Re: Rolling the Dice (Was: Re: T'orites and armor)

[Foo <fooboy@laf.cioe.com>]

That or do funny stuff like pointing over your target's shoulder and when
he turns his head thumping him one. ;)

Player: Look at the melons on that chick!
Actor : Huh?  *turns his head*
Player: *WHACK!*
Actor : *thump*
Player: That'll learn ya.

"I am ready to meet my Maker.  Whether my Maker is ready for the ordeal of 
 meeting me is another matter entirely."

- Winston Churchill

On Thu, 9 Mar 2000, Greg Mowczko wrote:

> And the book also clearly states the GM is always right. Or more precisely:
> 
> "This chapter contains a list of all the standard skills, where they are
> applicable, and how they are adjudicated. Please be aware that the GM may
> modify any check as he sees fit depending on the circumstances. If a skill
> does not list a specific die roll, the GM will assign an appropriete number
> of dice to check against the skill."
> 
> Bludgeon which will have very similar incapaciting results doesn't say how
> many dice are standard and I have had GMs make me roll 3d6 checks to allow
> me to blugeon non-standard creatures. Immobolize should work with the same
> abilty to have a non 2d6 roll.
> 
> 							Greg
> > From orc_food@yahoo.com  Wed Mar  8 17:27:37 2000
> > Date: Wed, 8 Mar 2000 14:26:19 -0800 (PST)
> > From: Andrew Luers <orc_food@yahoo.com>
> > Subject: Re: Rolling the Dice (Was: Re: T'orites and armor)
> > To: "Steven E. Ames" <steve@virtual-voodoo.com>
> > Cc: gmlist@cioe.com
> >
> >
> >
> >    Looks like I step in it.  The last point I will
> > bring up is to say is unlike Find Traps, Immobilze
> > clearly states 2D6. I an sorry but I think the skill
> > at a base of 400 proves information on where to hit or
> > not. The prayer at rank X should be able to see
> > missing kineys or bone plates under the skin.
> >
> >   Andrew L.
> >
> >
> > --- "Steven E. Ames" <steve@virtual-voodoo.com> wrote:
> > > 
> > > There are some skills that the GM rolls and not the
> > > player. Find Traps
> > > is one of these. The GM makes the roll because
> > > otherwise the player is
> > > granted too much information. In a succeed/fail
> > > scenario a player can
> > > roll the dice... but if there are more options? How
> > > about:
> > > 
> > > For example, lets assume that There _ARE_ traps. The
> > > player rolls his
> > > 'find traps' skill and succeed. Obviously the player
> > > finds the traps
> > > right? But what if he fails? Obviously he doesn't
> > > find them but he also
> > > knows that he failed his check and will just either
> > > try it again or ask
> > > someone else to also check for traps. If the GM
> > > rolls the dice and
> > > simply says 'you didn't find any traps' the player
> > > isn't sure which way
> > > it went. The player isn't sure if there aren't any
> > > traps or he just
> > > didn't find any. This is in keeping with reality.
> > > You can never be 100%
> > > certain, you can only be sure of what you saw. A
> > > failed roll might turn
> > > up something that looks like a trap but a successful
> > > roll would have
> > > dismissed it as not a real trap.
> > > 
> > > That said... greg wasn't suggesting telling the
> > > player how many dice to
> > > roll or using the rather lame successive dice thing.
> > > He was saying that
> > > they don't know how many dice to roll until they
> > > try.
> > > 
> > > Example: the player goes for the immobilize. He
> > > rolls 2d6 and annonces a
> > > successful immobilize. The GM says, sorry he doesn't
> > > go down. The player
> > > at that point knows he has to roll more dice.
> > > 
> > > The same thing could apply to the above detect traps
> > > example. It would
> > > seem that there are always two ways to do it:
> > > 
> > > 1. the player rolls and the GM can say that even a
> > > success is a failure
> > > because they didn't roll enough dice. The player
> > > knows that either it
> > > can't be done or its going to require more dice.
> > > 
> > > 2. the GM rolls the number of dice the player
> > > requests and then
> > > announces success or failure and lets the player
> > > decide what happened.
> > > 
> > > I'm more for #1 ... even in the detect traps
> > > scenario. Even if there are
> > > no traps the GM might decide that it would take a
> > > 3d6 check to determine
> > > that fact because the room is filled with smoke. So
> > > when the player
> > > rolls 2d6 and is successful the GM can always say:
> > > "you detect no
> > > traps". A good player should recognize that some
> > > situations require more
> > > dice and not go with the minimum roll.
> > > 
> > > Blah. Had my wheaties this morning :) (pay no
> > > attention to the inherent
> > > self contradictions in this message... they aren't
> > > there... your getting
> > > sleepy... Terrence and Phillip rule...)
> > > 
> > > -Steve
> > > 
> > > > no, the player made an incorrect assumption and
> > > > jumped the gun.  Wait to find out how many dice
> > > > it'll be, then roll.
> > > >
> > > > Wright
> > > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > > From: "Andrew Luers" <orc_food@yahoo.com>
> > > > To: "Greg Mowczko" <mooch@cioe.com>
> > > > Cc: <gmlist@cioe.com>
> > > > Sent: Tuesday, March 07, 2000 11:25 PM
> > > > Subject: Re: T'orites and armor
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >   Greg .. You don't tell the player how many die
> > > they
> > > > > need to roll!!! What do the poor persons do,
> > > roll one
> > > > > at a time to see how many they get? I have been
> > > know
> > > > > to do that in the past but almost never for
> > > skills.
> > > > >
> > > > >   Now to you srewing the person with the case
> > > cost 400
> > > > > skill. The skill clearly states 2d6 for unarmed
> > > > > tergets.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > --- Greg Mowczko <mooch@cioe.com> wrote:
> > > > > > As a GM I've had people try to immobilize
> > > someone
> > > > > > who wasn't normal and ran
> > > > > > it as following:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Player: Is he wearing armor?
> > > > > > Me: None you can see
> > > > > > Player: I immobilize him ( 2d6 roll ) Made it.
> > > > > > Me: Results, he is still standing
> > > > > > Player: What I made my check
> > > > > > Me: Correction you would have made your check
> > > if it
> > > > > > took 2d6 but that was
> > > > > > a 3d6 check since you didn't know he is
> > > missing the
> > > > > > kidney you tried
> > > > > > to hit ( or something like that )
> > > > > > Player: F*ck
> > > > > > Me: Does a 24 hit? How about a 25 and an 18?
> > > Take 26
> > > > > > points
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I'm for extra dice to the check with
> > > possibilities
> > > > > > of the player not knowing
> > > > > > they need to roll more dice to succede until
> > > they
> > > > > > try. Just like detect traps
> > > > > > is supposed to be done by the GM. You don't
> > > know if
> > > > > > you failed or not you just
> > > > > > know you didn't find a thing ( or you waste
> > > time
> > > > > > unarming a piece of hair that
> > > > > > go stuck in the lock that you thought was a
> > > trap )
> > > > > > Greg
> > > > > >
> > > > > > > From steve@virtual-voodoo.com  Tue Mar  7
> > > 14:10:32
> > > > > > 2000
> > > > > > > From: "Steven E. Ames"
> > > <steve@virtual-voodoo.com>
> > > > > > > To: "John  Hogg" <johnhogg@laf.cioe.com>
> > > > > > > Cc: "John  Hogg" <johnhogg@laf.cioe.com>,
> > > > > > <gmlist@cioe.com>
> > > > > > > Subject: Re: T'orites and armor
> > > > > > > Date: Tue, 7 Mar 2000 14:10:01 -0500
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Clothing and Robes are different. Clothing
> > > does
> > > > > > not provide any DV.
> > > > > > > Standard everyday attire or business
> > > clothing
> > > > > > gives you 0 CDV. Hence you
> > > > > > > can immobilize most people with no extra
> > > effort.
> > > > > > So... you don't have to
> > > > > > > be naked to get zero CDV... you just can't
> > > be
> > > > > > wearing anything armored
> > > > > > > or padded. Normal clothing also does not
> > > affect
> > > > > > your movement rate (GM
> > > > > > > adjudication for those tight leather pants
> > > you
> > > > > > like to wear).
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > I'm still pondering your extra difficulty
> > > check...
> > > > > > are you suggesting
> > > > > > > something along the way of an extra die per
> > > CDV?
> > > > > > So 3d6 for robes, 6d6
> > > > > > > for plate?
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > -Steve
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > > > > > From: "John Hogg" <johnhogg@laf.cioe.com>
> > > > > > > To: "Steven E. Ames"
> > > <steve@virtual-voodoo.com>
> > > > > > > Cc: "John Hogg" <johnhogg@laf.cioe.com>;
> > > > > > <gmlist@cioe.com>
> > > > > > > Sent: Tuesday, March 07, 2000 1:53 PM
> > > > > > > Subject: Re: T'orites and armor
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > 
> > === message truncated ===
> >
>