Re: Armor proposal 1

[Greg Mowczko <mooch>]

First off you write too much :)

> From: Benjamin Austin <jedi@ecn.purdue.edu>
> On Fri, 20 Nov 1998, Wright Frazier wrote:
>
> > Nope, there is salt and other minerals in it, just in low concentrations.
> > Low enough that is still drinkable.
>
> Then there is not a significant amount to oxidize metals to contribute to 
> corrosion.

Corrosion will still happen but a bit slower and you can prolong how long
it takes before it starts up.

> > I've run, and seen others run vessels with many armed and armored men
> > on the decks.  Seen landing craft full of armored men as well.  Last one
> > was about a month ago.
>
> It is not prevelant enough that I've run across one.  Therefore, back to 
> my original point, if only a handful of the marines wear them 
> occassionally, where are all the drastic improvements coming from?

Not prevelent enough because GMs don't play it that way. Doesn't mean it
doesn't happen ( conversely just because it happened doesn't mean its the norm.)
They are coming from warriors who are sick of being on boats and nearly
drowning. Marines are NOT the only fighting groups on the planets I'm sure
that Warriors ( ie mercenaries, armies and adventurers ) have put forth
towards developing the armors we have today.

Years ago there was no such thing as Dragon hide armor. Until Modreor
started to make it. And now if you know where to go you might be able
to get an outfit made.

> > Marines do wear armor when they don't want to die, or would do so more
> > if armor was accurately protrayed in AQ.  It however is _NOT_.
>
> Ah, so they haven't been wearing it so they haven't needed to modify it.  
> So, if no one is modifying it... refer to original point.  

The warriors are modifiying. You keep going on as if Marines are the only
ones with interest in this.

> > If it
> > was, it would be mobile, and give a fair amount of protection, but nothing
> > horendous like full plate armor.  Which while mobile as hell, was wholey
> > unsuited for use on a ship.
>
> Sorry, but I cannot by that I strap 100 lbs of _anything_ on and I am 
> "mobile as hell."

Wuss :)

> > You seem to have this mistaken impression that people wouldn't wear
> > armor if it was available.  Sorry guy, but not everyone is the kung fu
> > master from Kung Fu the series.  People wear armor because they want
> > to survive.  The average person take 1-2 hits to kill, maim, or put down.
> > Veterans take 3-4 hits.  If armor can extend this for 1 to 2 hits, then
> > that is a decisive advantage, and one you want if you plan to live.
> > The world isn't composed of rate 20 guys, or even rate 15 guys.  The
> > average guy is less than 10, usually less than 5.  The armor, shield,
> > and helmet make a huge difference in surviveability.
> > 
>
> But why would the average person wear armor?  It is not really cost 
> effective nor practical to wear going down the street to buy a fish from 
> the Rougtero market.  It would be like me purchasing and wearing a bullet 
> proof vest.  It is expensive and not really practical unless I'm driving 
> a potato truck through Gary, IN.

The average person would only where it if they were in a situation where
they felt it necessary and in most cases they won't have it.

> > If Jevan could swim in armor with 100lbs of stuff carrying a sword and
> > wearing boots, if people can run sprints in Kevin's mail, if people
> > can swim and effectively use a sword with only minor difficulties while
> > in the water, and do this stuff using real world equivilants, not stuff
> > that is specifically developed for water combat.  Then it is LUDICROUS
> > to think that Jaernians wouldn't have done it, and done it better and
> > in a way that is useable.
> > 
>
> Okay, any lab professor or scientist will tell you that 2 points don't 
> necessarily consistute a trend.

Yes but it proves a possibility.

> > More islands out in the world than Lojem.  
>
> True, but it is one of the bigger ones and seems to be a population hub 
> as well.

Known for trade. Plenty of armies have come wearing armor to take Karfelon
over.

[bit about Torites from Wright ]
> Correct and my point was that since they don't wear armor and they face 
> combat on a daily basis so others don't have to, who is modifying the armor?
> Your not going to hear a T'ortie bitch that armor is mobile enough.  So, 
> if no one bitches, who's going to change it.

All those warriors as I've said.

> > Restricting armor/weapon smithing.  That'd be fine with me since its
> > an intellegence skill and not something that can just be picked up
> > without either a) researching it b) being taught it.

Hey I find enough of a problem with these skills not belonging to Warriors
as it is. I know for a fact that I could not find anyone who could teach
me more about armor than Dom knows that I couldn't just come up with with
enough time to figure it out on my own.

> > Plate armor ruled the battle field because it was so effective.  It was
> > practically impenetrable, to such a degree that edged weapons were not used.
> > It took a heavy blunt force trauma impact to take down a guy in plate because
> > you had to either render the armor immobile by damaging it, or you had
> > to break the bones of the wearer.  
>
> Swords were crushing weapons, correct?
>
> > Plate armor disappeared for 1 reasons.  Quality guns.  Otherwise anyone
> > who could get it wore it.  Conquistadors tromping up the shores into
> > central america to kill the aztecs, 
>
> The Conquistadors got their bootys kicked by warriors (unarmored ones as 
> a matter of fact) with short sticks and knives.  Just a point on this - 
> I'm not familiar enough with your other examples.

Yeah but how many Aztecs are there now?

> > Bleh, I'm rambling now.
> > 
> > Wright
>
> I need to lay down.  All this typing in one day.
>
> BJ
							Greg